Hey guys, having driven my van for the past 4 years or so its always been hard to stop when trying to do so down a steep hill. It stops ok in normal stop and go traffic. I've never gotten around to verify if I have a leak at the master clynders or wheel cylinders. Nor have I checked the vacuum at the power booster. Reading EcumSecumGuy's post the other day about disc brakes he mentions brake fade as if it is an inherent problem with Gen 2's... So... is brake fade normal or should I be pulling my brake system apart?

Randy B

The problem isn't just with the 2nd generation vans. It's a problem (to some degree) on almost every older vehicle with front drum brakes. Drums don't dissipate heat as well as discs.
Another thing that can turn a fair braking setup into a poor braking setup, is moisture in the fluid. If you've never changed the fluid, I'd try that first. That's assuming that you don't find any leaks anywhere... If there are no visible leaks,, one sure sign that the master cylinder is dying, is the pedal will slowly drop to the floor when you have pressure on it for a while (like when setting at a traffic light).

Thanks Roger, I definately have the "slow pedal to the floor" syndrome. I'm really thinking of converting it to front disc's. My 73 F100 has front disc's with no power assist and it will almost stop on a dime. I'm going to completely rebuild the suspension in a few weeks ( new king pins, drag link, radius arm bushings etc) and that might be a good time to go the disc brake route!

Randy B

ps.. one caveat... I was supposed to start the front end rebuild in mid May! I hope to start it now in late June!

Randy
Do you have to add brake fluid from time to time? If the lines and wheel cylinders are not leaking , if you loosen the master cylinder bolts to the vac booster, check to see that there isn't fluid going into your booster? Could be a weak master, or air in the lines? I maually adjust my brakes every couple of weeks and really helps the brake's from fading to much.
Brett

Brett, I've never had to add fluid. I flush the system once a year though. I'll look into the vac booster for fluid. I get a feeling though that I'll be converting it to disc brakes in the very near future!

Randy B

the first time I experienced severe brake fade was with my 55 Belair. We were on the Cabot Trail - pretty serious hills with hairpin turns at the bottom. Lost the brakes almost entirely. I managed to shift down and crank the emergency to get her stopped enough to use a turn-out. I slid in sideways. Man it was SCARY

It has disks now. The reason I wanted to do the vanover to disks so bad is I plan to go to BC with it some day. But not in the
Rockies with drums (or a 240 for that matter).

So you're happy with your recent disc brake conversion??
Randy B

Yes, but remember I've got a e-200. Still have to put on the new flex hose.

And I am still testing it but all seems ok.

I think you could mount the proportioning valve just about anywhere up front, I chose the original location of the junction block but other sites would work.


I don't know about the E-100s and wheel fit. My bolt pattern is different so I can't try a 14" wheel.

If you have an E100 better talk to Mark about that at Scarebird.

Yes, this is normal.
Don't forget, they do not sell asbestos brake shoes any more (Original Equipment on our Vans and Older cars). The asbestos could take the heat. The new style "Organic" shoes do not take the heat. That is why they fade.

My father is the original owner of my E220 van and when they stopped making the asbestos shoes, the van would not stop any more. I went to Velvet Touch full metallic shoe. Those shoes stopped the van. The hotter they got, the better they stopped. It pulled more then a G when stopping. The guys in the van had a head rushes, they were surprised the van could stop so good. But I would have to buy new drums every time I put on new brake shoes.

They do make shoes out of other materials that work better then "Organic". You can run a "Full Metallic", Kevlar, Ceramic, or some of the racing material (Porter Field).

But Yes, the cheap pads suck.

Vic